Unmasking Bias & Building Equity

In this powerful episode of The Equity Hour, host Dr. Tami Dean sits down with Megan Fuciarelli, the Chief Empowerment Officer of US² Consulting, for a deeply insightful conversation on equity, identity, and social justice in education.

Megan shares her personal journey from a homogenous upbringing to becoming a national leader in DEI work, highlighting the critical need for educators to reflect on their biases and reframe curriculum to be inclusive. They also tackle urgent topics like recent policy changes impacting DEI, the role of language in equity work, and how educators can take action despite growing challenges.

🔥 Key Topics Covered:
✔️ Unlearning & Relearning
✔️ Bias & Identity in Education
✔️ Meeting People Where They Are
✔️ The Current Climate & Urgency for Action:

📚 Plus, Megan introduces her upcoming book Look Into My I: Intersectionality of Identity, offering educators a practical guide to self-reflection and growth.

👂 Tune in now and discover how to navigate this critical moment in education!

Discovery Call

Transcript

  

Yeah.  

Hello, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the equity hour with me, your host, Dr. Tami Dean. And of course, I'm so excited to have my guests because I'm excited about all my guests. Today, we are chatting with Megan Fucciarelli. 

 Megan is the visionary force behind Us Squared Consulting where she serves as the Chief Empowerment Officer.  She focuses on social justice issues, elevating institutions through a lens of deep understanding, and she is committed towards this transformational journey focused on success with social justice, equity, diversity.

and inclusion. And here's my favorite part about working and getting to know Megan is she truly believes this. And you know how I believe about community. She wants to create environments where everyone is seen, heard, welcomed, and valued. And I hear her voice in my head every time I read that or say that.

Um,  but it is so true. So Megan, thank you so much for coming on today.

so excited to be here. Thanks for having me.

Thank you. So just a little backstory, you all.  We always talk about the power of community and engaging with others that are doing this work. And, um, as you've heard me say, my friends say I've never met a stranger, which I just think is a really important way of moving through the world and getting in knowing how to talk to people.

So Megan and I were introduced through a mutual acquaintance. And it's like, the stars aligned, and the skies opened up, and it was all the things that we were supposed to be. So I'm so excited to have Megan be a part of my community, and be a part of her community. And I want to hear, and I want you to tell all the people about all the great things that you do at Us Squared.

And Tell me, okay, the brief version of your equity journey, because I know yours is long like mine. 

Oh, sheesh.  So how do I do the cliff notes version. So I have to say what I think will really resonate is My journey did not start down the path of transformation until I was much older, and I say that because I grew up in a very homogenous environment. Um, I grew up in White Lake, Michigan, and those of your audience members who do not know where that is.

I don't blame them, but it's exactly the way it sounds.  is full of white people and lakes. That's all that's there. So there was no diversity. There was no diversity of racial identity. There was no diversity of religion. There was no diversity of sexuality. I didn't see anyone who was different from me other than  A little bit of socioeconomic diversity.

That was really it. So growing up, you know, watching TV in the 70s and 80s, you didn't see representation. If you did, it was very stereotypical representation. So I didn't even understand what diversity was. And I grew up. pretty poor. So we didn't travel. We didn't go outside of the White Lake boundaries.

And then when I went off to college, I experienced significant culture shock. I had no idea what I was walking into. I was placed in the international dorm and being placed in the international dorm, being surrounded by people who did not look like me, spoke languages I didn't understand, ate food I had never even thought of.

Like, it was, I was so confused.

Your 

eyes were probably popping out of your head. Did you choose the international dorm or you just happened to get placed there?

No, I think it was one of those issues of my surname. Fucciarelli, I don't know if they thought I was from a te or, from Italy, or I did not choose it. I was placed there. My parents were afraid for me. Because it was, like, Oh my gosh, what is she gonna do? And then when we found out I had one roommate from Russia, which At that point, all I knew about Russia was the USSR and Mikhail Gorbachev.

Like I didn't know anything about. anything. I was so clueless, but one roommate was from Russia and another roommate was from Japan. And I just remember my parents were scared, not because they were hateful people, but they were also very sheltered, didn't understand. And their understanding of diversity was fear.

And yeah, being placed in the international dorm was a culture shock moment. I made a lot of missteps early in my journey, uh, went into education.  And that's really where it started, was I started as a teacher wanting to make sure that curriculum represented all identities. Um, I was really angry when I found out later in life that Thanksgiving wasn't the way I was taught.

Um, like I was angry. I was like, why did they lie to me? And then I felt horrible because as a teacher I taught Thanksgiving incorrectly because that's what I was taught. 

Yes, 

So

hear a funny Thanksgiving? Well, it's not really funny. You know how we always say something's funny, but it's not funny. You want to hear an 

interesting Oh yeah,  I would love to hear a story of awakening for you.

well, I don't know, it wasn't an awakening for me, perhaps. But it was around Thanksgiving. I was student teaching

Okay. 

I was student teaching with a very  traditional old school type teacher and she was wonderfully supportive of me as a student teacher and I was very much, I've been this way for  Since then, since I was like 21 years old, so this isn't new.

Um, but I had to teach about Thanksgiving.  And so I chose to approach it from the Native perspective of, the boat's coming over. What did, you know, I had all these books. I used all this children's literature. So using this whole other perspective. Yes, I did.  Because I just asked and she said, okay, and I did.

And then it was like this aha moment for her. But before we got to the aha moment, um, cause she knew, you know, part of my heritage is Native American. She asked me, well, first of all, she wanted me to read a book about Injuns with the red faces, which I was like, I'm absolutely not reading that book. But then she asked if I could do a rain dance for the kids. 

No, she did not. 

Oh yes, she did. 

So, I have to ask this question. Like, how did you, because I had to think back of how I even learned the accurate depiction of Thanksgiving. I wasn't taught it in school, right? Like, I actually perpetuated the issue by teaching it incorrectly for many years. Where did you learn or how did you learn about what actually happened on Thanksgiving?

Was it something you were taught in elementary school? Was it something your parents taught you? How did you learn?

neither one of those. Um,  really the.  I'll think I'll just say the catalyst for me thinking about that way when it comes to curriculum and education and what we are are not taught really goes back to, um, one of my undergraduate professors.   I can't I, I, I keep feeling like it was an extra project that I've decided to do for some reason, but I don't can't remember the details.

But anyway, I read dream keepers. So Dr Anna Floriani was my professor. She was amazing. But we talked so much about perspective. Um, cause she did my ELA methods course, and I think that was really the catalyst, um, like this aha moment for me and my education. Like, I always kind of knew it. But it just made it very real.

And then so from that point on, it really affected how I thought about  the perspectives or lack thereof that were available to me as an educator. How do I bring those in?  and just really kind of set the tone. For everything else 

Okay.

So, thank you,  Dr. Floriani and Dr. Gloria Ladson Billings for writing the book.

Right. 

So, I really don't know, but yeah, so I've been  looking at, you know, diverse texts and perspectives since I was a, I call myself a young little pup. 

Yeah, my college experience did not do that. Like there was no teaching of how to teach from different perspectives.  I had a phenomenal professor like you that Dr. Ivy Goduka. She is the person who opened up my eyes to diversity work and really understanding social justice and what we call it a squared Jedi work.

Um, she was from South Africa. I've tried for 30 years to get in touch with her like, I need you. Where are you? No one can find her. I've put please out on social media. I put her in my book, like, please, if you're reading this, I need to find you. Um, but it wasn't about perspectives and teaching and I never got that.

And I remember.  It was when I went to my own diversity training where it was one of the first trainings I went to and I was talking to some people there and someone was reading lies my teacher told me

Oh, mm hmm.

 I found so much stuff. Like that was the book that made me angry I was like what?

Why was I taught incorrectly? What? 

You know what? I had to read that book as an undergraduate too. Maybe that.

Yeah, I I wasn't I had graduated at that point when I read it because I remember I had taught Thanksgiving like I did the traditional all right half the class is going to make the hat and half the class is going to make the feather man like I genuinely did that right and I share that story when I do my work because there are still classrooms across the U.

S. Who do that to this day? And I'm like, look, I've been there. Like, I understand your intention is not to harm anyone. You don't know any better. But now I'm here to tell you that's not accurate. And you need to do something different. Like I'm

Like the hand where this

Yeah.

is the turkey and then this side is the Native American with the feathers. Yes. 

Like Many of us either did that as a child or maybe even perpetuated it by teaching it as teachers. Like, I was one of those teachers. I remember teaching thematic units about Africa. Like, it's this monolith of people. Like, I did so many horrible things.  And now here I am doing the work full time, and  it's part of that journey.

Like, we have to be human with ourselves and acknowledge that there's going to be growth. Every single day, I learn something new of, Ooh,  ooh, the origination of that's probably not something I want to perpetuate, so let's change my vocabulary slightly.

yes. And I think that's such an important point, Megan, is that I feel like. A lot of people think that this is like a boom, like a one and done, or,  you know, we just showed up like this into  the social justice work. And that's just,  I always say, like, it is an ongoing learning trajectory. Like there, to me, there's always something to learn.

I find out all the time, like,  I'm trying to think of one off the top of my head, but I can't, but there was some word I was like, I just bleh out and they're like, Oh, do you know that's rooted in? I was like, I did not,  but I am so glad you told me.

Yeah.  Yeah,  one of the big ones that we're still trying to shift language with a lot of our clients right now is especially in the education world, stakeholders and how you need to switch that to constituents and the whole purpose of where stakeholders originates from and you know that whoever holds the stake holds the land and that's how So many of the colonizers took the land from the native indigenous people here.

And  just really helping to shift some of that language. That's one of our more, I would say in the last year and a half to two years, that's been one of our big pivots. 

Yeah.

Yeah.

That, cause yes, that language is,  is pervasive. Well, you know, since you brought up school districts and. We're in such a great,  interesting, we're in interesting

times,

Oh, she sighed. Oh,

oh,  I'm shifting in my chair. Oh, 

okay.  For context,  this, this won't air this week. But, um, we're at the end of what I feel like is the longest January on the planet. Towards the end of January 2025.  And so if  There's just been a few,  changes over the last week or directives that have come down that are causing a lot of  angst, feelings, disruption, um,  to people. Like, there is Just this air of uncertainty.  I would say  conversations with people, there's a  of bounce between  how do I continue to do this work and hold space for myself? And not become an ostrich in the sand. That feels easier, but I can't do that.

Like all the things. So, um,  I don't even know where to start with that. That wasn't even a question, but 

I mean, what I'll say to that is yes, that part.  I mean, that's what I'll say to that, because. I will tell you that in the last week, I thought when you said that it was the longest January, I thought you're gonna say it's the longest week because we're exactly one week after inauguration and.  It has been a very difficult week for so many reasons.

Um,  I'll speak for myself, it's feeling like the weight of the world. Um, speaking for my clients, I just want to help all of them that we possibly can. I've had more late night phone calls, three hour conversations in the last week than I've had in the last two years. Um, and I've always been accessible, but we haven't had that urgency or that need or that sense of just hopelessness that we've had in the last week.

Um, quite a few of our education based clients are dealing with ice camped outside their doors.

Yes.

we have with immigration, we have just our very work of what we do. I mean, when you introduced you. Use the four words, right? Justice, equity, diversity, and inclusion. We don't use those words and how we describe who we are anymore.

It's not on our website. It's not on our social media because of one of the other executive orders that came through. Um, it's still the same work. We still do the same work at the same time. We know that if we are. Not allowed to enter the door simply because of the packaging that we're wrapped in, we're never going to be able to make an impact.

So when Trump was.  announced the winner back in November, we started making those changes, completely shifted our website, completely shifted our social media,  all of those things because we knew it was coming. Um,  but it's, it's difficult. And I have the privilege if I chose to partake in that of being a white presenting person in society. 

So I am not technically white, but I present as white and I was raised white, not knowing what my background was. I was adopted. Um,  but I have the opportunity if I wanted to, I could say, you know what, this doesn't impact me as much as it impacts others. So like you said, the ostrich in the sand, but I refuse to do it.

Right. I could go get a J O B. Working in a school system. I'm a retired school superintendent. I could go get a job, but I refuse to do that. Um,  and I'm sure you're struggling with some of those same things. Of the balancing act of how much do you protect your inner peace compared to how much do you protect the peace of humanity.

And  how do you balance those two out? And I will tell you I have not come up with that secret solution yet. I've not come up with that balance yet.  It's been a struggle.

Yeah.  I don't, I don't either. And I don't think there's a silver bullet because I think  It varies from day to day, and at least I'll just talk for myself. Like,  Monday for me was a day of rest as resistance, right? Um, and I think that's an important piece in this. Like, what rest is for you is going to be super important.

 And oh my gosh, the author is eluding me, but her book is amazing. You should read rest. It's a form of resistance as well.  I'll put it in the show notes. I can't, oh my God, her name is just totally blanking out of my brain. But  I think one of the  key things for me that you just said  as we were thinking about this, um, so I just had my birthday,  I turned 49.

Oh, I missed it. Happy belated.

Thank you.

Oh my goodness.

so as a part of that, I was inspired, um,  by this girl. I follow on Instagram. She's called the bloke, the broke black girl. She gives financial advice. She's hilarious. I love her. Um, so I did 49 for 49 and number 10 was. Social justice is still in style in air quotes here, everyone, because you can't see me, no matter who's in office.

And I think that comes back to when we think about  justice, equity, diversity and inclusion.  So it is hard. It is difficult right now. It feels like the weight is crashing down. And  people who have been doing this work through very challenging and difficult times for a long time, and there is still space and opportunity,  you know, to make good trouble. 

Yeah,

I just feel like and  when we get to the heart of what justice is. And it is  building the space for humanity and people and their humanity, period. 

Absolutely. And that's why, I mean, we can't give up and there's so many, I'm on a panel later this week. Um, and there were the words not to say, right. And that's so  disheartening and difficult. And I understand, right? I think that's one of the things that makes us squared a little bit different. And kind of my journey with this is I do understand the political aspect of it.

I am 100 percent get that there are certain things that I cannot say in front of certain groups. And I think that's why we're able to be received by so many different groups, because I understand that you can say the exact same thing in five different ways, depending on who you're speaking to, to be able to get the message across.

And it doesn't make you two faced. It doesn't make you a flip flopper, right? It just means that you're adjusting your message to reach the audience where they're ready to receive it. Because if the audience is not ready to receive what you share with them, they're not going to receive anything. So you have to meet them where they're at so that they can receive it. 

Yes.

Yeah, 

Absolutely. And I think  that is a very important thing for us to remember, right? Because I think  you see a lot of like pushing,  wanting to force  change and,  you know, I don't know. You can think of anything in your life. Like when someone tried to force you.  to do something. How well did that work out? 

You know, like if you're a parent and you were trying to force your kid to do something, they just, dug their heels in and were like, ha ha ha, I can last longer than you, you know, like people don't respond to that. But when you meet people where they are and you can engage with them, You're more apt to get the change that you are  seeking, or at least a recognition  of the viewpoint. 

I was just gonna say, or the conversation, right? The recognition of the viewpoint, the conversation. That's what this work needs now more than ever is the communication so that we can have just an understanding of one another. We've become even more polarized, which I didn't think was possible, but we've become even more polarized.

With the conversations, people aren't willing to listen to one another. They're digging their heels in. And this is on both sides. This is not just a pointing the finger. This is both sides are digging their heels in and not willing to listen. And if we keep doing that, it's just like a tug of war, right?

If you just dig your heels in and don't move, you're not going to win.  If you don't, you have to be able to come together to say, okay, what do we need? How can we understand one another? How can we have these conversations and we need to not make it criminal to have these conversations.  I mean, let's not go there, right?

That part where it's criminal and if someone is, I'm trying to remember, I just read this this morning, but last week with the whole everyone who has DEI in their title had to be released by 4 PM on Wednesday and then completely released by the end of this month. which is the end of this week. And then anyone who is trying to change their name to avoid the dismissal, if anyone has insider information about someone who changed their name or an organization who changed the department's name, they are, there's a reporting hotline that people can report companies who have just shifted the name of their departments.

or have shifted the titles of people within their organizations. There's a reporting hotline so that you can tattle on people of, Hey, you changed your name. You're still doing DEI work. You need to be out. 

um, I don't know about the last part.  Um, I'm kind of speechless right now, which is very rarely a thing for me. It just,  my,  my heart instantly went to, like, history is repeating itself.  

Is. 

I don't think it's too far removed and please tell me if you disagree with this, but I, I don't think it's too far removed that we have a hotline to report people that want that are changing titles to keep their job to uphold. honoring humanity of people with,  you know,  people reporting  other people that are holding Jews or harboring them or hiding them or don't believe what the Nazis are saying.

Like,  it isn't as far removed as I think people want to think it is. And that is just where I'm like, my heart went like, I'm, you know, 

When, before he was sworn in, one of the first things he said he was going to do was the mass deportation. Right. And I remember when that first came out  and I was like, we're going to have.  a holocaust part two, a Trumpacost, basically, and it's going to be people hiding, harboring  immigrants,  not people who are Jewish, but immigrants.

Yes. 

And  I just,  and here's the thing, it's not about politics right now, like we say it is, we're talking about politics, we're talking about the executors, we're talking about presidents, we're talking about, right, but to me it's not about the politics, it's about the state of humanity that is allowing this to happen. And no one is stepping in to say, hello,  like, and when I say no one, I'm saying no one at that level that can say, Hey, this isn't something we should do.

And yes, I understand. They're all executive orders right now. They're not necessarily law. They haven't been passed through all the necessary protocols, but  if you just look at the rundown of what he's done in just one week,  so many of those are direct slaps in the face to anything related to social justice work, anything related to humanity and honoring the diversity of this world.

I mean a smaller example, but the Gulf of Mexico being renamed the Gulf of America. I mean, come on, like Some of the things that were done last week are just what, what, like what?

why? Like,  part of  I don't even know what to say to that. I saw a clip of Hillary Clinton just laughing at that, and I was like, I feel you so much right there. Like, why? Like, when we think about being the President of the United States, your biggest goal is to rename the Gulf of Mexico?  Right?  And Denali, yes.

No! No! What? Like, you are the leader of the  United States of America. I need you to act. Like, you have some sense. Um,  it just doesn't make sense to me. And yes, they're all executive orders. And part of me feels like we're also part of a smoke and mirror show. Like, we're gonna do all these crazy things so you don't pay attention to what's happening over here on my right hand.

So,  I want us to be wary, right? Like, and be diligent. And pay attention to what's also happening in the right hand. Because it's easy to get distracted by all of the nonsense that you miss. Something really important  that is coming and yes, the people right  that should be the checks and balances are not being the checks and balances right now.

But I just really want to give a shout out to like the educators right now that are having to deal with this, this order that is removing their schools and their districts as a safe space. Like, I don't know. Um, You know, Dr. Morero, he's the superintendent of Denver Public Schools, he's also the president of ALAS, like, in their guidance, they're like, do not let them in, right, like, I just want to praise these educational leaders that have been under so much stress and the gun for so long now, and now this is another layer, right, added to that,  But they're stepping up to protect the students and the staff that are in their buildings.

And  I think we should all follow their example, like, and stand up when it is in our privilege and power to do so, whatever that might look like for us. 

 I'm so glad you brought that up.  Where I'm at, . I'm in metro Detroit

but I spent a lot of my time in Chicago and I still have a lot of contacts in Chicago and ICE is out in full force in Chicago. And so many of the schools have done like that. Quick professional development. How do we help our students?

How do we handle if ice comes to the doors? There were multiple schools in Chicago public who turned ice agents away and said, I'm sorry, but you're not welcome here. Um, and that to me takes a lot of courage. And I'm so glad you brought that up. You know, where I'm at right now in the metro Detroit area, we don't have a large Latinx or Hispanic population.

So we're not seen that as much right here,  but as soon as he expands that net right now, he's focused on the Latinx and the Hispanic communities.  If he enlarges that net, I mean, Dearborn, which is in metro Detroit, has the largest Muslim population in the U S. So if he expands the net to different identities, we're definitely going to see more of it here. 

I mean,  and you just think back to the detention centers. I mean, they're still trying to reunite families from that debacle.  You know, separating those kids, so,  

And then we have only two genders being recognized.  But at the same time, when all that's happening, we're actually talking about this with my team tomorrow, there are countries around the world who are stepping up to do even more to try and. bridge that gap. Now, for people who don't have the means to go to other countries, it doesn't help as much, but it does show some solidarity across the globe.

So, you know, Thailand is investing a huge amount of money towards trans, uh, medical procedures and gender confirmation surgeries. And like, there's just, there's other countries around the world who are doing some really cool things right now. Um,  It doesn't help those of us here in the U. S. though.

Mm hmm. Mm hmm.  But I can see how that can be also like a spark of hope, right? Like,  you know, and there is a privilege to be able to go to another country to do all of those things. It shouldn't,  your identity should be honored and valued and welcomed in the country you live in, 

We would hope.

you know. Um, we, yes, we would hope, and,  oh, the complex history of the United States of America that thinks it's about equality, but really, not so much.



I mean, and let's talk about how people talking about how our system is broken. Our system's not broken. It's operating the exact way it was meant to be operating. 

exactly.

It was built upon these foundational principles of privilege and  here's the thing. It's not about we shouldn't feel guilty for privileges that we have in today's society because of our ancestors.

At the same time, if we acknowledge that we have some of those privileges or access to opportunities, it's our responsibility to use that to uplift and um, empower those without that same opportunity.  That's the piece that gets lost in translation.  People hear us talk about privilege or access to opportunities are like, Oh, see, you're shaming me again.

No, I'm not. There's no shame. There's no blame. Like this is what it is. This is how our country was built. So how can we make it better for those of us who might not fit into those small boxes of the quote unquote founding fathers of the U S. 

Well,  speaking of that box, neither one of us belong in that box as women, and women,

Nope. 

women are also under attack, and are, you know,  bodily autonomy, our,  I know everybody jokes about the Handmaid's Tale, but again,  if you've read the book,  or even if you've watched some of the show, women helped make the society against women happen.

Mm hmm.

we're like, Oh shit, what did we do?

Well, that's, there are so many people in the U. S. right now having that oh, shit moment. Oh, shit! What did we do? I mean, it's not just women having that, there's a lot of people having that oh, shit. When he said he was going to do this, I didn't think he meant this.  Those of you who can't hear what we're talking about, it's because we're not talking.

we're not talking, we can

our screen. Like, what? 

It's like, imagine the mind blown emoji. That was both of us, that's right now, like  He has repeatedly been the same person. Whether he was trying to be president or not trying to be president.  He  has consistently  shown who he is.  And 

he's not a good person. 

But here's the thing, here's the thing, and I say this over and over. The problems we're experiencing today are not just because of him. Like, we can't give him that much power. And when people are, like, demonizing him and everything, it's like, he is a product of society. And the reason why he has so many followers is because he's just speaking the language of more than half of our country saying, yes, we have someone speaking our language.

And it's not just white, cis, straight men. Who are following him.  Like it goes back to the Handmaid's Tale. We have so many women who voted for him. We have so many people of color who voted for him. We have people who identify as trans who voted for him. Like I don't understand. I don't get it. Now at the same time, it depends on what your values are.

Like I'll be the first one to say when he was in office, my investment accounts, my retirement accounts all looked a lot better. Absolutely. If I voted based on money, absolutely I get it.  But I would rather be broke and know that my son will be safe as a black man in America any day.

Hands

Any day! Mm hmm. 

down. Like,  hands down.  Um,  I think this,  I'm gonna come back to this oh shit moment for, cause people are really like, oh, but not my healthcare. If you get your healthcare  from the same place, it does include you.  There's, there's no exclusion.  And,  I mean, let's not get it twisted,  powerful men  with money have always sought to seek and support other powerful men with money.  Historically speaking, if you look at history,  this is not an exclusionary thing, right? 

Mm 

So, the idea  that he cares how much your eggs are  and your gas,  that means nothing.  It means, it really does, it means nothing to him. 

hmm. He hasn't had to buy eggs or gas. Like, that's not been, I don't think, ever in his life. And I'm not saying that you have to be from a certain mentality to understand the plight of middle class America.  But  in some levels, it does help to have been there at some point. Like, he's always been from money.

He doesn't, that's not, he doesn't care about that.

Well, and let's be frank, even though he's lost millions and millions of dollars, his privilege  has allowed people to continue to invest even though he's not all that successful.

Mm

He gives the air of success, right,  and, you know, plays that card really well 

Mm hmm. 

because if I tried to run a business or your business, right, you lose millions of dollars and go bankrupt. 

Is someone just going to give you another loan for multiple millions of dollars like next month?

no. 

No.

gosh, no. 

So when we talk about the system, that's part of the system. Right, is,  you know, there are people that are doing their absolute very best, but still can't get access to funds they need to do the things, to be the entrepreneur, to run their own business, to pay, you know, all those things, because of how,  well, I'm gonna use the word gatekeep, because how it's gatekeeped,  that's,

And if we go down this path, you know, with the reversal of Lyndon B. Johnson's Equal Employment Discrimination Act, right?

mm 

If we go down that path, And we say that you cannot show preference to specific identities, you cannot look at that as a factor, which the whole reason why so many certification agencies came to be, like WeBank, which is women owned certified, uh, MSBDC, which is minority business owned, uh, NGLCC, Gay and Lesbian Business Owned.

Like, all of those certifications came to be so that we could open the door for opportunities that were not typically open to us previously.  If he's successful with making all of that illegal, you cannot take that into consideration, then what is going to be the role of all of these certification agencies that are meant to uplift and empower and open the door for groups that have not historically been granted those opportunities? 

Like we need to wreck it like this is writing that's on the wall and there's still to this day People who are like, hmm. I'm just it's gonna blow over. It's It's going to be fine. It's not, and I'm not a doomsday, or I'm not chicken little saying the sky is falling. Like that's not my personality. My whole thing is, I'm not saying that we need to retreat.

I'm not saying that we need to wave the white flag. I'm not saying we need to leave what we're doing. But we need to be aware of all of these things so we know how we need to navigate moving forward.

yeah,  absolutely,

the thing. We can't, another saying we say, right, like we have a lot of sayings, you know this.

Been with us for a minute, but like you cannot heal what you do not reveal.

mm hmm.

Right? Like, once it's been revealed, once we talk about it, once we have it out in the open, we can work through solving it. We can heal from the pain that it causes. But if we just act like it's not there, it's just gonna fester.

We're never gonna be able to heal. We're never gonna be able to move forward in a more productive, healthy way.

Yeah,  absolutely. And this is the result of that, right? The denial of the treachery of slavery and Jim Crow and all, you know, like America's just really tried to sweep that under the rug rather than facing it head on.

Or the Japanese internment camps. Or the westward expansion, eastward invasion. You know, like,  all of the things.

of the things, right?  And,  you know, I'm going to talk about the Holocaust again, but you look at what Germany did after that horrible period in their

And they still do.

Yes. Yes, right, because they don't want to forget and  I feel like they're looking at America right now. Like,  hello. Hello.  Well, I think the world is looking at America right now.

Like,

right. And if you ask anyone in the world, most people will refer to the Holocaust as one of the most  atrocious, atrocious events in history. Like, anyone across the world will refer to the Holocaust. And guess what? Germany, starting at kindergarten, teaches their kids. What happened during holocaust so that it doesn't continue to happen.

So it doesn't happen again. So they learn from previous mistakes, but the US is oh no, we can't even bring up those words.

oh, no, and we can't, we're going to call them workers and not slaves,

and did you know that slavery benefited those that were enslaved  because it taught them skills that they could then use in their next. enslavement.

oh, yeah, that's super helpful. And, you know, the civil war was about states rights.

Right!  And the confederate flag is a true meaning of pride. 

Mm.

In some cases, sure, what are you proud of? 

Mm.

Because I know what I'm proud of, and I know what the pride of the confederate flag stands for, and they don't really match, at least to me. But everyone's different, right?

Mm hmm. Yes. Yes. They don't,  they don't, they don't match. They don't match. Okay. Let's go back to. 

The math isn't math

The math doesn't math. I, I, I don't even know what to call this math. You know, we got girl math and all this math. I don't even know what the, like,  math,

take Girl Math because, you know, Girl Math got us on the moon, but, you

girl, oh, heck yeah.  Girl math,  that's that fear.  That's anyway,  let's talk about what is revealed  To be healed it I don't know if I'm gonna try to segue this because I do want to talk about your book and  I think  one of the great ways to start and think about Social justice is to start with yourself And your life, your experience, your identity. And so, very excited. Megan has a book coming out.

Should be released March 13th. It is called, Look Into My I. Like, I, the letter I. Uh,  intersectionality. of identity. And I'm really excited to hear more about this book because we hear the word intersectionality thrown around all the time. We hear the word identity thrown around, um, and especially now when we have some identities coming into question.

It's

Yeah.

like a perfect timing. So  tell us about your book, Megan. Yeah.

Look Into My I is the second book through the Metamorphosis series. So, Metamorphosis was my first book, and it's actually the first of a series. It's the juxtaposition of metamorphosis and justice. So, it's transforming the way we look at social justice. Within the globe within our country within ourselves.

Um, and within look into my eyes, we're going to dive deeper into what identities we've identified as really key indicators of what shapes. who we are, how our lived experiences are impacted by those identities. So we have 15 identities that us squared has kind of identified, focused on. We're going to dive into each one of those, and then it's going to follow the same structure as my first book, which there's quite a few journal prompts.

There's some activities, some practical examples, some stories from my own experience as well, just to really try to help people see themselves in that conversation. And we're also going to talk about the idea of the cycle of bias and how that bias that starts from ourselves can really continue to be perpetuated into a larger system if we don't check it at some point.

So we go through the cycle of bias. 15 different identities. We talk about how All of them make up a piece of who we are, and together that creates us as unique individuals, but that no one identity defines who we are as people. And really just helping people understand that aspect of it.

Yeah.  That sounds super Super empowering to, to think about it that way because people tend to,  you know, pigeonhole people into one identity or even yourself, right? Um, and I think it's great to look at the cycle of bias because one of the things, um,  I share a lot is like everyone has bias.

Mm hmm.

And it's how do we recognize that and interrupt that and  knowing that that's not like an accusation where sometimes we'd be like, Oh, you're telling me I have a bias.

You're, you know, you're saying I'm a racist, right?

about what we're saying.

No, it's saying that's human nature. And. It comes about due to  our life experience.

Exactly.

Yes, yes. So, love the journal proms, because we get to reflect. This sounds like a perfect timeline for this book and your first book. So people have time to read the first book, to prep for book two.

Like, I think if you're not sure where to start, uh, Megan's books are a great place for you to start and get thinking and connect with her and the S squared community.  I know they're putting out some great things on their weekly newsletter too on LinkedIn.  Um.  Where can they get your book, Megan? 

So my first book right now is available at Amazon, Barnes and Noble, Walmart, Target. It's in all the main outlets. And then my second book will be in all the same places, but we're really trying to encourage people to go to Amazon, um, because we're Our goal we were international bestseller for our first book and I would like to keep that trend going so March 13th as many sales as we can get in that first week to be able to get to that international bestseller status again Yeah, 

Super exciting. And of course, I will link all of the information so you can go get her book so easily from the show notes and go visit her if you or your organization needs support.  With how to navigate some of these conversations,  in either your school environment or within your corporate environment,  because it's helpful to have.

a team and a thought partner,  in this journey. And I am just very thankful to have the privilege to work alongside Megan with this work. Um, this work isn't easy, but again, the community you surround yourself with while we're in This space and doing this work, I think is super powerful and helpful when we're both just sitting here like, what? 

Right? It lets you also know you're not alone, right? Because if you start to do it in isolation, you feel like how I'm feeling might be how no one else is feeling.  And that's probably not,  not the case.  Okay. So I'm going to put all that in the show notes and, you know, I know I could talk to you for hours, Megan, 

I feel like there's so many things we could dive into at the same time We both probably want to get a little bit of sleep tonight.

know, a little bit, you know, I, every episode I'm like, Oh, that could be another episode. Whoever I talk with. Cause there's just so many things that we can discuss, but I do want to end with my, one thing that I do at the end of the show is I always have my guests share like their , what's your tip for the listeners?

Like what's the one thing you want them to take away? What's one thing they can do to get started? Um, what's your advice? 

I feel like we've talked about this a little bit, but my number one piece is that every single one of us has something that we can do now to be part of the change and As scary as it might be, as difficult as it might be, I just want everyone to keep moving and keep moving towards what they want to see in the world.

And, you know, as my wall says, be the change you wish to see in the world. That's what we all need to be focused on right now. And just taking those small steps while also having boundaries to take care of ourselves. But just taking those small steps because it's going to take all of us and  we can't give up now.

As much as they're trying to silence the work we're doing, we cannot be silenced right now. 

Absolutely. I agree with that.  And I always talk about that. How can you use your voice?  So consider and keep thinking about that. And thank you all for joining us again today. I will make sure to put all those links in the show notes and go check it out. And that's it for this episode. Thank you. 

Thank you so much.